February 13th, 2009, 06:32 PM
Cabrio Fault Code F50
Well the wife is fit to be tied. Our Cabrio washer, Model WTW6400SW2, has set a F50 fault code. It is less than two years old. I know that code is usually a problem with the RPS sensor(W10183157). I didn't have time to work on this problem so we called in a service tech. He ordered a replacement sensor and tried to put it in today. We still have the same fault code with the new part installed. The tech called Whirlpool and was told that the sensor and control unit have to be changed together. We are in for over $500 on this repair so far and it still doen't work. Any comments or suggestions would be welcomed.
February 13th, 2009, 09:38 PM
I hope at least the tech(?) did some checking before ordering an RPS board. The F50 is usually associated with a motor or motor controller (main board) failure, but I have also seen it caused by a faulty wiring harness, or even something as simple as a sock stuck between the basket and the tub. I am not aware of the RPS needing to be changed together with the new board as they are not 'matched' components. My suggestion would be to make sure the tech is following the test procedures as outlined by Whirlpool, or get the tech sheet out and do them yourself. Based on the part list, the possible parts are well under $500 so you may be able to fix it yourself and send the tech packing. I usually support independent servicers, but I don't like it when they leave customers with bad answers and wondering what now. It makes the rest of us professional technicians look bad.
February 13th, 2009, 09:57 PM
Thanks for the reply Brian. I don't know how far the tech went with his troubleshooting as I was offsite. Unfortunately he did not leave the old part here. I will try to get the old part in hand and run through the diagnostic checks myself. The basket turns easily by hand. I've been googling these cabrio error codes and there seem to be a lot of problems with these machines. I guess a g-note doesn't buy much of a machine anymore....
As before, comments or suggestions are welcomed.
February 13th, 2009, 10:12 PM
They are a very good machine as they are based on the Fisher & Paykel design, but Whirlpool licensed it and what I call 'Americanized' it which basically made it double the cost and now it seems to have double the failures. They have been prone to F51 errors as this was a supplier problem that was fixed early on, but it did occur an most of the units at one time or another. The other problem of late is a rust issue under the top panel that is the result of excessive detergent usage. An updated tub ring was created to combat this issue (I wrote about it in a post on my blog) that seems to work better, but many of them are developing rust that starts to migrate down the side. But the rest of the unit is pure F&P which has turned out to be a very good product. Hope you get the part back and can take a look at it yourself. It is worth repairing, but no sense in wasting money doing it.
February 14th, 2009, 02:59 PM
Here is the latest. I ran the washer through a manual diagnostic test. The RPS installed by the tech was working fine, blinky lights when the tub was spun by hand. I wish I had the old RPS to test but the tech took it with him. I then set the lid lock and tried to spin the tub and got the F50, motor stalled code. You are right Brian, the F50 code isn't about the RPS it's indicative of a failed controller. I continued my checks and verified that the motor stator windings were OK, 30 ohms phase to phase. The wiring between the controller and the RPS and motor was good. I repowered the washer and started another manual diagnostic session. This time I was looking for output voltage from the controller to the BPM(Brushless Permanent magnet Motor). My older Fluke 87-3 is not really a good meter for troubleshooting VFD/VSD drives but it should see a changing output voltage. I didn't see any voltage from the controller to the motor. So now I need a new controller. The tech told me about $150 for the part, old p/n W10130544 new p/n W10189966, plus shipping.
The tech's repair quote was for $347.50 flat rate plus an $80.00 diagnostic charge plus $50 for overnite shipping of the part. The RPS kit was $84.73 leaving a balance of $262.77 for their flat rate labor. The tech's repair company says that they use the MASPG blue book for their quotes. This flat rate figure seems over inflated to me. The service call was during normal weekday hours. Can anyone confirm the MASPG rate for what was diagnosed as a RPS replacement service call?
One last bit for now: The service tech left one of his tools behind when he left. I gave him a friendly call today to let him know it was here and remind him that I want the old RPS. Maybe I'll get the old RPS after all....
February 14th, 2009, 06:20 PM
I am not sure about the MASPG rates as I don't use them, but those figures seem rather high given the difficulty of the repair. Based on your checks, it sounds like you are going in the right direction. The old number that starts with 'W' has been updated to W10189966
February 16th, 2009, 02:46 PM
Here's the latest... I fired the repair service but agreed to pay the charges for the service call and the part that I probably didn't need. Last Friday night I sent a happy-gram to Whirlpool.com and they responded back...
> Thank you for visiting the Whirlpool web site. We appreciate hearing from you and apologize for the delay in response.
> We regret to hear of the difficulties you have experienced with your Whirlpool washer. Whirlpool is dedicated to manufacturing top quality appliances and to standing behind those products in the event of a problem. We realize that the purchase of an appliance is just the beginning of our relationship with a customer and we genuinely appreciate you selecting our brand over all others. Our files indicate service has contacted our technical department about the washer repair.
> In order for us to properly evaluate your situation we will need more information than provided in your e-mail. Please answer the following questions.
> Which service company checked the washer?
> Has the repair been completed?
> Did you pay for any service? If so, list the charges.
> Is the dryer working properly?
> Please respond. Thank you for allowing us to assist you today.
> You are a valued Whirlpool customer and we apologize for any inconvenience this concern may have caused.
> We invite you to contact Whirlpool again either by calling (866) 698-2538 between 8:00am to 11:00pm EST weekdays or by emailing whenever the need arises. When calling please press the available option or stay on the line to reach a representative.
> Tabitha G.
> Whirlpool Customer Loyalty Team
> Whirlpool Customer eXperience Center
So I told them my story and we'll see if they reply back. BTW I copied a link to this thread in my email reply....
February 21st, 2009, 08:04 PM
Update: I received the controller board on Thursday. I changed it out without any trouble. I put the washer in manual diagnostic mode and the new board drove the motor to spinning. I made some points with the wife! Unfortunately the washer had a pretty good vibration at higher spin speeds, but removing the BPM rotor and re-indexing it to the motor shaft took care of the vibration. Whirlpool says that they want to help, so I've sent all my receipts off to their customer service group. We'll see what happens.
BTW. I am impressed that they can put a little variable frequency motor drive on a controller board and make it so cheap. I guess they occassionally fail, but still its pretty good tech-stuff for a washing machine. I wish that I could troubleshoot and repair the board....
February 21st, 2009, 09:54 PM
Glad to hear you got it worked out and hopefully Whirlpool will make things right.
March 6th, 2009, 10:27 PM
Cabrio F50 Wrap Up
We got a check from Whirlpool. They covered the cost of the RPS kit that we didn't need and part of the shipping. Beats a stick in the eye! Thanks Whirlpool.
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