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KDTM354DSS4 Dishwasher seems to have problems starting wash and draining

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
Model Number
KDTM354DSS4
Brand
KitchenAid
Age
1-5 years
Hi -

I've got a Kitchenaid KDTM354DSS4. Recently, I noticed the water at the bottom of the tub not draining completely (and resulting in less than clean dishes). It seems to have gotten worse, so I started paying closer attention. I also noticed during some cycle, the washer would fill with water, sit there for a minute (or few?), and then drain. Othertimes it would actually run fine during this phase - it seemed unpredictable.

So I ran the service diagnostics - cleared them first (pushing HI-TEMP at the right time), verified they were clear, and then ran the tests. I got the following two errors: 8-2 (Drain Pump Electrical Problem) and 6-1 (Low/No Water - Mechanical problem).

I'm surprised to have two different errors that point to different components. The drain pump seem fine (measure resistance of ~35 Ohms), but haven't looked into the inlet valve yet. But, as I said, I feel like that is going down the wrong route. Any idea what might be going wrong here? Is it the control module?

Thanks!
 

Jake

Appliance Tech - Admin
Staff member
Joined
Aug 24, 2004
Messages
123,839
Location
McMullen Valley, Arizona
Hi,

Ok, this model has the problematic door vent, that can also cause all these problems you are having.

Do this first--->Disconnect all the wire connectors to your door vent and see if it runs through a complete cycle.

Start reading what bigbuck said at post#18 here:

Your model uses the exact same door vent. If it runs through a complete cycle and everything is back to normal, then order and replace the door vent assembly.

Here it is for your model you can order:
WPW10469574 Vent


To access the vent assembly you will need a T-15 torx screwdriver: Remove 4 screws (long) across top of door, then remove 10 screws (short) on the sides, then the outer door panel pulls off.

Let us know what you find.

Jake
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
Hi Jake -

thanks for the response. I opened up the door, unplugged the two wire harnesses going into the vent, and closed it back up. Ran the service diagnostics and then tried running the wash. The tub filled up with water, it sat there humming a bit during the first cycle (assume it is heating the water?), and then I start hearing a clicking noise from underneath (some relay or solenoid?). Every few seconds - click! After a few minutes, the water drains without ever activating the sprayers. I cancelled the wash at that point.

Any other ideas? I never paid attention before, should I expect it to keep clicking from underneath every so often?
 

Jake

Appliance Tech - Admin
Staff member
Joined
Aug 24, 2004
Messages
123,839
Location
McMullen Valley, Arizona
Ok, then you can put the door vent wire connections back in place.

From your last post, On these models there has been a problem with the pump filter breaking and jamming up the wash motor, thus you will hear just clicking and no water will spray out the spray arms. Id check that first.

Here's that pump filter you can order if needed:
Pump Filter W11084156


It's in-stock here: W11084156

If the pump filter is fine, I'd next use a multimeter to check for 120 volts at the wash motor after it fills and should be running, if you get 120 volts and the wash motor is not running, then the wash motor is bad.

Here's the wash motor for your model:
Circulation Pump W10902589


Here's the entire pump and motor assembly for your model: W10805015 PUMP&MOTOR

Here's the video:


Let us know what you find.

Jake
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
Hi Jake,

Thanks for the advice. I ended up getting the entire pump and motor assembly as the circulation pump was out of stock everywhere and my wife and I were very tired of handwashing everything daily.

I ended up buying from searspartdirect, since they were the only ones who had it in stock. Got the part, installed it, and everything worked. Well, at least it did for a couple weeks.

Earlier today, my wife noticed water at the bottom of the tub. I checked the codes and got back 8-2, 6-4, and 8-1 (in that order). That's pretty disappointing. I'm guessing it's a defective pump and motor assembly? I was going to call SearsPartDirect tomorrow to see if they could send me a new one.
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
One other thing to add: it does seem like the washer is having issues draining now. By this, I mean I hit the cancel/drain button, close the dishwasher and it takes a while (several minutes) for the dishwasher to drain. This is not typical, as it used to always do this pretty much immediately. Could this really be the drainage pump?
 

Jake

Appliance Tech - Admin
Staff member
Joined
Aug 24, 2004
Messages
123,839
Location
McMullen Valley, Arizona
Take the drain hose off to where it hooks up under the sink, get a bucket and put the drain hose in the bucket and see how fast the water comes out. It should come out with good force.

If not, remove the drain hose and see if you feel a clog on in elbow of it.

Here's the drain hose for your model:
W11084165 Hose-Drain


You also should have a drain hose extension too. Goes from the drain hose loop to the house drain. 6-1/2 feet. Check that for clogs too.

Here it is for your model:
Drain Hose 8269144A


Jake
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
Thanks Jake for the reply.

I did as you said, disconnected the drain hose from under the sink and put it in a bucket. Then I filled up the dishwasher, let it run for a moment. Then, hit cancel/drain. Closed the dishwasher and waited about 30s to a minute. After that, I saw the cancel/drain light turn off. Nothing.

I then tried it again - hit cancel/drain and closed the door. This time, it did drain, almost starting immediately. I don't know how good the force is supposed to be, but it filled half my bucket in under a minute (maybe even half a minute). My guess is that it isn't clogged, but it's tough for me to know what the expected force is. It wasn't like a outdoor hose turned on. If I had to guess, it was 40% of that.
 

Jake

Appliance Tech - Admin
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Messages
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Location
McMullen Valley, Arizona
I don't know how good the force is supposed to be, but it filled half my bucket in under a minute (maybe even half a minute).
That's good.

hit cancel/drain. Closed the dishwasher and waited about 30s to a minute. After that, I saw the cancel/drain light turn off. Nothing.
Was it doing this problem before you replaced the entire pump and motor assembly? It almost sounds like the door isn't closing/latching properly, becuause when you open and closed the door the 2nd time, it drained right off the bat.

Check to make sure the dishwasher is properly installed and level back in the position you had it, before you replaced the entire pump and motor assembly, so the door closing properly.

Jake
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
This is a new problem. The dishwasher was pretty close to level, but was slightly leaning toward the front. I've adjusted and am running tests. Will update if I see the issue again. Thanks for all the help!
 

Jake

Appliance Tech - Admin
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Messages
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Ok, yes keep us posted.

Jake
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
So, it seemed to work fine for the last 3 days, and I was getting hopeful all was fine. Unfortunately, a wash just finished and ALL the water was still left at the bottom. I hit the cancel/drain button and some of the water drained out. I then hit the cancel button again and closed, and the remainder did succesfully drain out. It does sound like the drain pump is struggling to turn on at times.

Any thoughts?
 

Jake

Appliance Tech - Admin
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Joined
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Messages
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Location
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Ok, it sounds like possibly the drain pump is working intermittently. You will need to stay at the dishwasher and when it doesn't drain you will need to check for 120 volts at the drain pump.

You will need to remove the electrical connector from the drain pump and get a multimeter and set it on AC Volts, then put your meter leads in the drain pump electrical connector that you remove from the drain pump, then WHEN IT SHOULD BE DRAINING see if your meter reads 120 volts. If so, and the drain pump is not running, then your drain pump is bad.

Here's the drain pump for your model:
Drain Pump W10914557


Jake
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
I got the drain pump today and replaced the old one in the dishwasher. Did the diagnostic run and got back another error code: 6-2, which is saying there is an electrical problem with the fill-valve. Do you think I should attempt to replace that? The connection on it seems fine, but I don't know what to check other than if it fits snug.
 

Jake

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Messages
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Location
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When you start a new cycle, does your dishwasher fill with water? If so, after it fills do you hear the wash motor come on and start splashing water inside the tub?

Jake
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
It does fill with water and I do hear water splashing around. I did clean the dishes succesfully last night (it's been on and off for succesful for the past week or two).
 

Jake

Appliance Tech - Admin
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Messages
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Location
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Ok, then lets clear that error code.

Do you have your tech. data sheet handy?

Here it is for your model: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1DPe34l9BUJbeMkUcAbyBZNdDs2McNTMp/view?usp=sharing

Put it in the diagnostics again and then look at the Service Diagnostics Notes. Note 4--->Press HI TEMP key in this interval to clear customer error history. If you look at the interval chart Note 4 is Interval 20.

Jake
 

merowe

Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
10
Location
Michigan
I have the tech sheet & I also did clear the customer history the last time I ran the diagnostic (that resulted in 6-2). So, I do think that is legitimate. I will, however, give it another try later today to see what happens again.

Thanks!
 
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