Sears Kenmore 665.1577580 Doesn't Dissolve Soap and Seems to Have No Water In it?

Ponchoguy

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Model Number
665.1577580
Brand
Sears Kenmore
Age
More than 10 years
Jake:

Doesn't dissolve the soap (always did, use Finish tabs) and I do not hear the traditional "swoosh" of the wash cycle I used to hear. I believe the first thing I'm going to do is to ohm out the water inlet valve as I have interrupted it a few times and I do not see any water in the bottom of the tub. I do hear it cycle and pump out and it goes through all the cycles. I did replace the inlet valve back in 1994 (!!!) when it froze during a bad winter storm (and I left the garage door open at the time, which is right below the kitchen).

Good thing is that I do have a brand new WLP OEM inlet valve in my stock :), so I'm thinking to ohm out the unit and if I don't get between 500-2000 ohms, that I have a partially or totally stuck valve and I should go ahead and change it in the spring (I don't like to fool with water too much when it's cold). I can shut the main off in the garage when it gets warm :).

Do you think this is a good plan to start with the valve check? Thanks as always.
 

Ponchoguy

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I checked the inlet valve with an ohmmeter and on the 2k ohm scale I get .683-.684 ohms which I guess would translate to about 684 ohms, so it seems that the electrical part is not dead. I'm wondering if it's mechanically failed and that's why I don't see any water in the tub? Again, I do have a brand new valve in my stock (WLP original).

Thanks.
 

Jake

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Hi,

When you first start a cycle do you hear it filling with water? If so, after its done filling look to see how much water is in the tub, normal water level would be just below the heating element.

If you don't hear it filling with water, You've either got a timer problem, or water inlet valve problem, or a float/float switch problem.

To narrow this down you'll need a multimeter to test for 120 volts to the water inlet valve when it should be filling at the beginning of the cycle.

What I do is take the electrical connector off of the water inlet valve and put my meter probes in each of the two electrical terminals, then start the dishwasher and see if your volt meter reads 120 volts, give it a few minutes after you start the dishwasher.

--->But, First check your float switch, that comes before your water inlet valve. Also check the float itself to make sure its not stuck in the UP position, because that would cause you not to read 120 volts at the water inlet valve.

--->Move the float UP and DOWN and listen for a clicking sound as you do that.

--->The float switch is underneath your tub just under the float stem.

If the meter reads 120 volts then that indicates the water inlet valve is the culprit.

Unfortunately, the water inlet valve for your model is No Longer Available from the factory. So you got lucky if you have one in stock.:)

Let us know what you find.

Jake
 

Ponchoguy

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Jake:

Thanks as always:

1) No, I've interrupted it several times and I don't see really any water in the tub, if any at all.
2) Yes, the float switch clicks, and moves freely. I tried it yesterday. I will check it with the DVOM to verify it's good electrically..
3) I will check for 120V at the connector. I assume it does not matter which probe is in which terminal?
4) I guess I could have a mechanical problem with the inlet valve, since it "checks out" with the DVOM test.
5) I see some moisture on the floor, but I noticed a cracked slip nut on the drain pipe that the machine drains into. So, that's a separate problem and I'll look into it.

I will try the float switch test, then the 120V check of the inlet valve and failing that, I will change the inlet valve with the new one I have in stock. Yes, it was a good price, it was a WLP #WP303650 OEM part so I figured I would stock it (I think I paid $15 for it, and it's a USA made one, the last versions when available were made in China).

Thanks and I hope to report back soon.
 

Ponchoguy

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Jake:

I get 120V when I turn on the machine, checked it with the meter. I do get a click from the float and it works freely. I do have some concern about the tub area. As I related, I noticed some moisture/staining on the floor under the machine. I took a photo of a "recessed" area in the tub. When I rub my finger there, I do get some water on my finger. I'm wondering about that. If the tub is a goner, then I think it's time to put it out to pasture, as a leaky tub isn't going to solve anything. I do still believe I have a bad water inlet valve.

What do you think about the attached photos? The unit was installed by my late Dad in 1986-1987, so it's certainly got its use. I'll replace it if need be, but if it's not an issue, it's not an issue. However, I can be sure that any water under the machine isn't a good sign.

Thanks as always.IMG_0228.JPG
 

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Jake

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Yes, I see the photos. Yes, its time to retire this dishwasher per your photos.:)

It had a very good run all those years.:)

And yes if you got 120 volts at the water inlet valve electrical connector when it should be filling and its not filling, then yes your water inlet valve is bad.

Jake
 

Ponchoguy

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Yes, I see the photos. Yes, its time to retire this dishwasher per your photos.:)

It had a very good run all those years.:)

And yes if you got 120 volts at the water inlet valve electrical connector when it should be filling and its not filling, then yes your water inlet valve is bad.

Jake
(Plays taps....). Yup, a good run. I guess the tub finally rotted through. I attached a better photo of it.

Now for its replacement. I'm thinking of a WLP unit with a stainless steel tub, hopefully with manual dial controls. What models would you recommend?

Thanks again. Better to cut losses than to put good money after bad. Over the years, I replaced the door springs twice, the inlet valve once and the heater element once. Not bad for 32 years of service. Never saw a repair person, only me :).

IMG_0224.JPG
 

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Jake

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Yes, I see the other photos you posted, looks even worse on that last one.

I suggest Maytag as your next dishwasher, I bought my Maytag dishwasher when I moved from Oregon to Arizona in March of 2014 and not a single problem with it at all, dishes and silverware are sparkling clean every time.:)

Here's the Maytag I own: Maytag MDB4949SHZ 24 Inch Built In Full Console Dishwasher

Unfortunately they don't make any dishwashers with the old style knobs anymore.

Jake
 

Ponchoguy

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Jake:

Yea, I'm seeing that with the dials. LOL. My "must haves" are stainless tub (longevity) and black in color (goes with the kitchen, same color as what's there now). I'm with you on the Maytag, I prefer Whirlpool brands----they tend to be easier to fix and parts are available everywhere. Sure, they all have their problems, but WLP tends to make the most sense.

Believe it or not, I plan to "strip out" the old machine and sell the parts online. For someone keeping "old gold" alive like I liked to do, they'll have a shot and doing that. I sold some of the parts from my grandfather's machine that way and made some money back.

Looks like Home Depot stocks that in black in my area, so that's on my list. It also fits my budget of what I planned to spend. I'll do some online price comparison.

As always, thank you for your insight and assistance.
 

Jake

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Whirlpool owns Maytag.:)

So the Whirlpool quality is the same for Maytag.:)

For someone keeping "old gold" alive like I liked to do, they'll have a shot and doing that. I sold some of the parts from my grandfather's machine that way and made some money back.
That's a good idea.:)

Let us know what dishwasher you get.

Jake
 

Ponchoguy

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Whirlpool owns Maytag.:)

So the Whirlpool quality is the same for Maytag.:)


That's a good idea.:)

Let us know what dishwasher you get.

Jake
Frigidaire makes one model, model #FBD2400KS with dial controls. However, it has a plastic tub which I think I would shy away from. A stainless tub is a better option. I have a family member that will help me with the install of the unit if I can't swing a free install from the seller.

Thanks again, Jake.
 

Jake

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Glad to help Poncho.

Jake
 

Ponchoguy

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Jake:

I was also considering these machines from Sears (downloading the owner's manuals, they show them to be "665" WLP made products). I get some points for future things (like Craftsman tools that I buy) and I think I get some money off using a Sears card. Any opinions? I'm not worried about fixing it in the future, since when it is out of warranty and requires repairs, I would do them myself. My thinking is that they use common across the board WLP parts that would still be available even if Sears does go out of business:

https://www.sears.com/appliances-dishwashers/b-1020017?Brand=Kenmore&Color%20Family=Black&Tub%20Material=Stainless%20steel&filterList=Brand%7CColor%20Family%7CTub%20Material&sortOption=UNITS_HIGH_TO_LOW

Thanks.
 

Jake

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Yes, 665 is made by Whirlpool.

Anyone of those dishwashers are fine to buy.:)

Jake
 

Ponchoguy

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Thanks again. One of them is a "587" prefix so that's made by Frigidaire. I'll go with the next model up which is a WLP made unit. My water source is to the right of the dishwasher, so I'm hoping that there's enough room to snake the water supply under the unit to the inlet valve. The electrical connection is BX and comes up from the garage underneath it, so I think if the electrical hookup is still in the right side lower corner, I should be OK to get both in place (hoping). I'll look at the install manual for the one you suggested and see how that lays out.


I'm also thinking of installing the Repair Clinic's "drip pan" underneath so that for the future should there be a leak, I can spot it 1-2-3 and make repairs. Oddly enough, I used to periodically take the lower toe plate off now and then just to check things out. LOL.
 

Jake

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Ponchoguy

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Yes, that one. I figure it could not hurt. I plan to install the dishwasher in the spring when the weather is warmer. Fortunately, I'm one person so the d/w is of course nice to have, but I just wash what I use after using it :).
 

Ponchoguy

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Jake:

I'm hoping that no matter which one I get, it will fit. Both the Maytag you suggested and the Kenmore I'm considering seem to be the same size. The electrical connections seem to terminate in the same spot (lower right corner). My water supply is to the right of the dishwasher unit in the cabinet under the sink. On the current machine, it's hard/bendable copper line and the water inlet is on the left front of the machine (the inlet valve is mounted on the LH interior frame behind the toe plate. I'm thinking of swapping that out for a flex connector (from the kit). I'm hoping the following:

1) I can raise or lower the machine enough to make it fit under the counter. I'm thinking I have to get it down to about 33 1/2 or so on the height. I know that the motor cannot touch the floor.
2) Width seems OK, I seem to have 24" clear from frame to frame on the cabinet.
3) I'm hoping I can snake the flex line under the machine and hook it up. Looks like I need that "garden hose to compression" elbow that comes with the install kit.
4) I think there's enough wiring to reach where the new connection box would be. The old one is hardwired (BX cable, required in NYC). Looks like I have to get a strain relief.

I'm thinking that if I get an install kit it should have everything I need based on what I'm reading. Would you go with the braided style supply line or the "better than braided" one? Seems that no matter which WLP/Maytag/Kenmore (ala WLP) unit I get, I will have the same set up.

I'm sure it will all go together well, it's just a matter of putting the pieces together :).

Thanks again----I've been watching the prices on them!
 

Jake

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Ponchoguy

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Jake:

I think that will work. I'll take photos of the underneath of what's there now and show you where the utilities are entering the machine now. A picture (or two) will be worth 1000 words. LOL. Thanks again.
 
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